[Rant] A Generation Of Gamers That Dont Know What Role Play Is ? (Dev) Replied

"Not all UO Vets agree. And, fortunately, SotA will not provide a fulfillment of your wish."
"Doesn't really matter what you want, or what you believe. You're not getting it here."

Some of the first words I heard when coming to SotA forums after seeing a RG interview on MMORPG.COM and getting excited. Someone that speaks with such certainty you would assume would know what he was talking about. Luckily I got a post from another forum member that linked to Hex Instances and later discussion revealed the PVP Flag so I figured out this very well could be the game I was looking for. Those were the noble words of Knight Commander Rufus D'Asperdi, have you heard of him? Not very Knightly if you ask me.

 

From what has already been said everyone in a party will be forced into the same "flag" as the party leader, so whether party comes before or after flag shouldn't make any difference.

 

I am however referring to priority of hex-instancing though I see your point in that current flag is the same as your party, however I am not partied with all flagged people hence party > flag and not party = flag.

 

Yes... I stand by those statements. Not all UO veterans agree that Ultima Online was the ultimate, best ever MMORPG and SotA will not recreate that enviromment, fulfilling their wishes. The second quote was aimed at someone that wished unrestricted, world wide, flagless PvP in the same style as pre-Trammel Ultima Online... They're not going to get that here. Even you have said that. Should I have been more verbose? Generally, people complain that I'm not succinct enough... perhaps I should seek a better balance between the extremes.

So, if the recreation of Ultima Online's PvP enviornment is the only thing that will satisfy someone, and they will consider no compromise, is it a favor to them to give them hope that their wishes might be fulfilled?

 

They'd have to go to that thread and judge for theirself, but as the player you were responding to it made me think this was a hostile community as apposed to a welcoming community. Now I know that you want to have dinner with me in Austin so I understand you didn't intend it to be hostile.

It is my opinion that open pvp flagged players will get a very UO like experience.

 

Truthfully... both statements were intended to be mildly hostile. The expression of frustration at a stream of UO PvP mavens who've arrived one after another with the same desire, based on misconceptions and revisionist history hoping for UO2. Taking Spiritual Successor to mean exact recreation. I'm sure it will happen again... many times.

Again, I agree completely... And I support with my whole being the inclusion of PvP in Shroud of the Avatar. However, I hope you can see and agree, that there are those in the PvP camp who will accept no compromise short of a recreation of the Pre-Trammel rule set from Ultima Online. If their expressed desire is true, then they are likely to be disappointed with Shroud of the Avatar, and will not find the fulfillment of their desires here.

 

Let's wait for them to show us NUMEROUS logs then? Which proves absolutely nothing, because I was never reskilled on newb areas. And even if I was, I wouldn't tell you, cause I'm not afraid of ganking, and you are. Stop complaining over things that haven't happened. Embrace open PvP. Embrace Roleplaying for once. it doesn't bite.

 

The endless debate of "Is SotA going to be like Pre-Trammel UO?" The answer is no.

 

No.

 

The answer is Possibly in some hex instances.

 

Correct, which means no open world PvP.

 

It's not them that have to convince us. It's us that have to convince them. While keeping in mind that, at least for this specific group of devs, many of them have way more experience with this kind of game than any of us can hope to achieve, so using unsubstantiated hunches or anecdotal evidence in an attempt to sway them away from their present course can be counterproductive.

Never going to embrace non-consensual PvP, sorry. And, when I say never, I really mean it. Made the attempt in the past, I'm not going to make the same mistake again.

Also, non-consensual PvP, for me, is the antithesis of roleplay; I see it mainly as throwing away everything that makes roleplay a good and interesting hobby, everything I've learned in over two decades of roleplaying, and turning it into just an e-peen contest. So, my desire for roleplaying actually means utterly rejecting anything to do with non-consensual PvP.

 

xD

 

No more than life in the wilderness is anthitesis of life of no risk or danger in a greenhouse.
I'd prefer to call the former "Life", and the latter - "existence".
We're having exactly the same dychotomy here regarding roleplaying. You think that killing dragons for leveling in a fantasy setting is enough to be called roleplaying.
I think it's not enough, and real MMO roleplaying is alot more than that.

In DnD you had the DM to emulate the world for you. World, weather, environment, beasts, allies, enemies - bandits, skeletons.
In MMOs you no longer need the DM. The DM is the game itself.
Why do you want to exclude the bandits, the brigands, the bad people? The thieves, the murderers, the poisoners, the suicide bombers?

When you play DnD, do you force your DM to play only weak enemies against you, so you win all the time and never have to sweat? Tell me more about your tabletop gaming experience. Because I find your statement (the one I quoted) amusing.


addendum: I have nothing against very harsh penalties for PKs. I am not afraid of that. I am used to playing almost naked, very carefully. Saving every bandage, every potion. No luxury for the PKers, to that I agree, partly because I am forced to by all of the casual folks out there.
But to remove non-consensual PvP and looting? Curse you, Lord Garriott! Damn you! You are no longer Lord of mine!

 

Heh, or MUDs where your opponent could lay 12 actions on you before you can even press, "n."

Ahh the good old days

Sent from my EVA Unit-01 using Tapatalk

 

Well, MUDs are muds, they have nothing to do with MMOs then or MMOs now.

I mean...trilobites could have been eating their s***t in order to extract remains of minerals (like for example rabbits do), but we as the descendants of trilobites don't have to care about their way of life and their eating habits.

 

Interesting perspective from one that has probably never had to actually live in fear of death. OWPvP usually has no game consequences for your actions. No life-time in prison. No perma-death. No dying in squalor as a hunted person. No real world moral implications. Its always "Damn I'm dead, Okay respawn."

Interesting thing is both sides are right. Why? Because it is subjective debate regarding a method of entertainment. As the market reflects enough people on both sides of the fence, games wanting to be successful today need to a) provide good methods for both or b) be very up front as to the restriction.

 

I've been in...situations. You don't know anything about my life. Please. Don't.

It does not need such harsh consequences. A harsh pk-penalty system would be enough.

When you create something, you gotta chose between market and art.
I don't care about the market. I demand art. Have you the courage to do the same? Or you prefer to be all smart and nerdy and count the dev's money? "hey they cant do that cause nobody wil lbuy the game and they will go bankrupt and close the servers".
Heard this chant many times. Probably coming from people very talented at business and economics. No doubt, yeah. Otherwise why would they be chanting this like some kind of mantra?

 

People who whine about having their 'immersion' ruined by getting PvPed at some point on their little adventure make no sense to me. What exactly happens to your immersion when that dragon you are tying to slay actually slays you and your whole group? What happens when you step on a trap and turn into a column of fire? What happens when you bump into the wandering monster 'bandit' and it kills you? Why is a real person doing these things so much different than computer AI doing it?

The answer is simple and has been with us since UO1. Have most towns safe, have newbie safe areas, and have a system that accounts for criminal deeds. That's all you need! Even having a single player option for this game is a mistake as it will drain total player experience and synergy. People with paper thin sensibilities are ruining the feel of this game.

 

Art is subjective. While I enjoy competition, most OWPvP becomes who can play the latest cookie-cutter build and out-gank the other usual more with numbers than skill.

Smart and nerdy is what gave birth to the genre and has kept the genre alive for decades through multiple mediums. Remember SotA is the Ultima spiritual successor, not UO's. Its as much about the story coming into a livign world rather than some king-of-the-hill playground.